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All times shown according to UTC.
| Time | Nick | Message |
|---|---|---|
| 00:04 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 00:05 | Francesca | hi rangi |
| 00:06 | eythian | dcook: from another channel: <eythian> http://www.regionalwines.co.nz[…]-ballsy-beer-pack <-- wizzyrea_ should get the first one of these |
| 00:07 | dcook | eythian: Mmmm beer |
| 00:07 | * Francesca | is very confused |
| 00:07 | dcook | What do I have at home at the moment... |
| 00:07 | eythian | > Uggh I hate that. You'll just be out buying a newspaper and Trent Reznor starts chasing you around. <-- t/hee |
| 00:07 | wizzyrea_ | hee |
| 00:07 | dcook | My wife bought it for my birthday back in June but I've been too sick to enjoy it, so I'm saving it for when I can smell and taste again.. |
| 00:08 | Bahaha | |
| 00:08 | I forgot about that video! | |
| 00:08 | rangi | heh |
| 00:08 | dcook | Usually when I think of Trent Reznor, this is what I think of though :p |
| 00:08 | rangi | did we have any nine inch nails at whisky? I think don covered every other band from that era |
| 00:09 | wizzyrea_ | lol no I don't think so |
| 00:09 | that is clearly an oversight | |
| 00:11 | eythian | something something hundreds kidnapped something something ;) |
| 00:15 | rangi | https://twitter.com/esilibrary[…]28579060482846720 |
| 00:16 | dcook | hehe |
| 00:16 | Yeah, there are a few places I might be reluctant to travel to | |
| 00:16 | Meeting time | |
| 00:16 | wahanui | mmm meat |
| 00:16 | wizzyrea_ | haha |
| 00:17 | rangi | oh yeah im not planning to go out wandering around by myself |
| 00:41 | cdickinphone joined #koha | |
| 00:47 | Francesca | hey cdickinphone |
| 00:47 | wahanui | cdickinphone is also a sleep deprived zombie |
| 00:48 | cdickinphone | Hiya Francesca |
| 00:48 | Francesca | tell me are you still a sleep deprived zombie? |
| 00:48 | cdickinphone | By definition, no, by feeling, yeah |
| 00:49 | Thankfully, that's not why i missed my 12pn lecture | |
| 00:51 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 00:56 | dcook | I don't know why, but this just went through my head: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrwOxpac0XY |
| 00:58 | cdickinphone | That's what happens before i descend into zombiedom |
| 00:59 | dcook | That reminds me I have a lot of sugary snacks to eat right now... |
| 01:00 | * dcook | needed a bigger desk to accomodate the second monitor and all these cookies and donuts... |
| 01:02 | cdickinphone_ joined #koha | |
| 01:29 | dcook | hey wizzyrea_, eythian, rangi: might one of you let me know what's in a sample <pluginsdir>? |
| 01:30 | eythian | I think I just set it to /var/lib/koha/instancename/plugins |
| 01:30 | and put the plugin in there | |
| 01:30 | dcook | Cool. That makes sense |
| 01:30 | I can't tell if the path I had in my dev was set by me or a default or what | |
| 01:30 | Been too long since I set the thing up.. | |
| 01:31 | mtj- joined #koha | |
| 01:47 | irma joined #koha | |
| 01:49 | mtj- joined #koha | |
| 01:51 | JoshB joined #koha | |
| 01:52 | dcook | Ergh... unexpected errors are the worst |
| 01:52 | Especially when they're silent.. | |
| 01:53 | eythian | but deadly |
| 01:54 | dcook | Yeah, for some reason when I search for "test" the EDS plugin is adding "undefined" into the search query |
| 01:54 | or something is.. | |
| 01:54 | But this didn't happen on my dev install yesterday... | |
| 01:56 | Looks like maybe some missing cookie or something? :S | |
| 01:57 | mtj- joined #koha | |
| 01:58 | dcook | Yep... cookie troubles |
| 01:58 | That's not nice.. | |
| 02:00 | mtj- joined #koha | |
| 02:01 | JoshB joined #koha | |
| 02:03 | dcook | Oh man... updating plugins for 4 different instances and they're each giving me their own special problems.. |
| 02:03 | Can't even uninstall the plugin in one of them :S | |
| 02:04 | Permission issue. Zap! | |
| 02:04 | eythian: Have you seen Weeds? | |
| 02:04 | eythian | yep |
| 02:05 | dcook | I'm midway through season 7 right now and my favourite line? |
| 02:05 | "My password is 'policeofficer' all lowercase." | |
| 02:05 | eythian | heh |
| 02:10 | dcook | Ugh maybe it's not a cookie maybe it's local storage.. |
| 02:11 | Yep. Local storage is me problem. Oh nose... | |
| 02:11 | That won't be fun telling a bunch of users that they need to clear their local storage... | |
| 02:12 | eythian | erg |
| 02:12 | mtj- joined #koha | |
| 02:14 | dcook | I think it's because I updated the authentication info.. |
| 02:14 | * dcook | tests this again |
| 02:15 | dcook | Hmm nope not that.. |
| 02:15 | But somehow it's the local storage :S | |
| 02:16 | Ah I think I know.. | |
| 02:16 | Nope.. | |
| 02:19 | mtj- joined #koha | |
| 02:20 | cdickinphone joined #koha | |
| 02:30 | dcook | For any Pixies fans: https://play.spotify.com/track[…]WhuzqrbqQuqanFFJ6 |
| 02:38 | mtj joined #koha | |
| 02:39 | dcook | It's because of DefaultParameters... or lack thereof... |
| 02:41 | Which is stored in local storage... | |
| 02:41 | But not checked at all.. | |
| 02:44 | Which happened in this case because of an upgrade from 1.6 to 1.8... | |
| 02:50 | aleisha joined #koha | |
| 02:51 | dcook | Interesting... not sure if there's actually an update mechanism for the local storage :S |
| 02:52 | Mmm maybe it does.. | |
| 02:57 | Hmm the value in jStorage_update is about an hour ago... | |
| 02:58 | * dcook | thinks perhaps the EDS plugin sets TTLs but doesn't get TTLs... |
| 02:59 | dcook | I thought it was supposed to "auto expire" though.. |
| 03:05 | mtj_ joined #koha | |
| 03:08 | mtj joined #koha | |
| 03:08 | cdickinphone_ joined #koha | |
| 03:12 | dcook | Oh well. That's why I love open source. People can find and fix problems :D |
| 03:16 | mario joined #koha | |
| 03:26 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 03:28 | dcook | Oooh |
| 03:28 | You can upgrade plugins just by uploading them again... | |
| 03:28 | Sweet as | |
| 03:29 | That's really handy actually.. | |
| 03:29 | Francesca | hi dccok!! |
| 03:30 | dcook | yo Francesca :) |
| 03:30 | Francesca | what's up in your little corner of the world? |
| 03:30 | dcook | Mmm keeping super busy |
| 03:30 | Francesca | I'm avoiding writing an essay |
| 03:31 | dcook | Certainly a worthwhile effort :p |
| 03:31 | Francesca | essay writing is evil |
| 03:31 | ibeardslee | /kick Francesca Do your essay! |
| 03:31 | Francesca | lol |
| 03:31 | i am kinda doing it | |
| 03:32 | just also working on other things at the same time | |
| 03:35 | anyone got any tips on writing a proposal? | |
| 03:42 | cdickinphone_ | When i had to do the proposal for my project, there was four major points they boiled down to |
| 03:42 | Francesca | ok |
| 03:46 | * dcook | was an English major, so he's written a loooot of essays |
| 03:46 | dcook | Just tweaked the EDS plugin :). I think I'll send along a pull request in a little bit |
| 03:46 | Git all the things! | |
| 03:47 | * Francesca | is a music major |
| 03:47 | Francesca | unfortunately that still means essays |
| 03:47 | dcook | Is the essay about music or is it for an elective? |
| 03:47 | Francesca | nope its for an elective |
| 03:47 | course is called WRIT 101 | |
| 03:48 | dcook | Fun times! |
| 03:48 | * dcook | is glad he doesn't have to write essays anymore |
| 03:48 | * Francesca | is jealous |
| 03:48 | dcook | Well, other than my Bugzilla test plans. Those are practically essays. |
| 03:48 | Francesca | lol |
| 03:48 | The stuff I do for #koha is mainly web based | |
| 03:48 | no essays | |
| 03:50 | dcook | Essays can be fun! |
| 03:50 | cdickinphone_ | Francesca: 1. Problem, 2. Proposed Solution, 3. Evaluation, 4. Requirements |
| 03:50 | dcook | But usually not until third year.. |
| 03:50 | Francesca | ugh 2 more years |
| 03:50 | and really? essays? fun? | |
| 03:50 | dcook | In my fourth year, I think I was writing essays about Ghost in the Shell |
| 03:50 | It was good times | |
| 03:51 | Francesca | cdickinphone_ : I don't think they're looking for a solution |
| 03:51 | dcook | Although when I wrote a paper about A Scanner Darkly comparing the film and book, I was pretty disappointed as it was clear the prof wanted the paper written his way |
| 03:51 | Francesca | lol |
| 03:51 | cdickinphone_ | Francesca: what are you proposing then? |
| 03:52 | dcook | Francesca: Every time I wrote an essay, I felt like I had to teach myself how to write essays all over again. |
| 03:52 | Francesca | according to the course outline we write 3 essays |
| 03:52 | proposal, critique a source, and research | |
| 03:52 | dcook | O_o |
| 03:52 | Francesca | its not all due tomorrow |
| 03:52 | dcook | How can a proposal be an essay? :S |
| 03:52 | Francesca | I dunno |
| 03:52 | cdickinphone | How can a proposal not propose something? |
| 03:52 | Francesca | but the course is called something like introduction to essay writing |
| 03:53 | dcook | Well then they should teach you, no? :p |
| 03:53 | Francesca | cdickinphone: no idea |
| 03:53 | * dcook | would be avoiding this project as well in this case |
| 03:53 | Francesca | yeah I think my tutor is fond of the learning on the job idea |
| 03:53 | * dcook | learns on the job and somehow manages to not suck at it :p |
| 03:53 | Francesca | lol |
| 03:53 | dcook | Well, in my self-critical opinion. I might be biased... |
| 03:54 | Francesca | hahahahaha is there someone else we should ask? |
| 03:54 | dcook | That's a good question |
| 03:54 | cdickinphone | Can you give me more of an idea of what they want? |
| 03:54 | dcook | I would say the people in #koha but I suppose not all of my work winds up here. Less and less really :/ |
| 03:55 | Francesca | we are to 'explore a debate' |
| 03:55 | dcook | No shortage of that on the internet |
| 03:55 | cdickinphone | The debate being? |
| 03:55 | Francesca | in my case: obesity in nz |
| 03:56 | I was going to write about the airport | |
| 03:56 | but the tutor said it wasn't a strong enough debate, and didn't have enough expert opinions | |
| 03:56 | cdickinphone | Oh |
| 03:56 | Yeah, that sucks :( | |
| 03:57 | * dcook | always preferred to use logic than experts in his essays |
| 03:57 | cdickinphone | I guess they want it to be cited? |
| 03:57 | dcook | (mostly because the experts weren't often that logical...) |
| 03:58 | Francesca | cdickinphone: yup |
| 03:58 | cdickinphone | Okay |
| 03:59 | And explore the debate... Are you supposed to take two opposing arguments and analyse them? | |
| 03:59 | Francesca | yup |
| 04:00 | eythian | dcook: if I want to quickly learn about the query parser stuff, where would I go? |
| 04:00 | dcook | insane? |
| 04:00 | eythian | in particular, I'm interested in its inputs and outputs |
| 04:00 | heh | |
| 04:00 | probably | |
| 04:00 | wahanui | i heard probably was not, but i do not know another way |
| 04:00 | dcook | Hmm.. |
| 04:00 | eythian | oh |
| 04:01 | dcook | http://evergreen-ils.org/dokuw[…]al:search_grammar |
| 04:01 | eythian | it looks like it doesn't do what I wanted anyway |
| 04:01 | dcook | The link is both helpful/unhelpful |
| 04:01 | As our implementation doesn't work the same as Evergreen's | |
| 04:01 | eythian: It needs some work :/ | |
| 04:01 | eythian | I'm looking for some nice generic search structure that I can use, that I can transmute into an ES query. |
| 04:01 | because parsing strings sucks | |
| 04:01 | dcook | That it does |
| 04:02 | Ideally, you could use the query parser | |
| 04:02 | Although I think you'd have to write a driver for it | |
| 04:02 | eythian | well, I'm in a position where everything is computer generated |
| 04:02 | dcook | In the long-term, I would think it's the way to go? |
| 04:02 | Hmm? | |
| 04:02 | eythian | so, I don't need to parse strings or anything |
| 04:03 | cdickinphone | Francesca: what else do you do apart from that? You don't try to find common ground? |
| 04:03 | eythian | I was hoping that the QP has some nice standard intermediate format that I could steal |
| 04:03 | but that doesn't seem to be how it works | |
| 04:04 | e.g. it'd take a string, turn it to format X, then other things turn format X into a specific query language. | |
| 04:04 | then I could just use X to be consistent | |
| 04:04 | but that doesn't seem to be what happens. | |
| 04:05 | so I have to make up my own intermediate query language | |
| 04:05 | dcook | Hmm |
| 04:06 | It would take a string and turn it into its own format X... then your driver would turn it from format X into a specific query language, yeah, I think so | |
| 04:06 | eythian | right. but where can I find what X is? |
| 04:06 | dcook | But it's format is a parsed query tree I think |
| 04:06 | Well, it's an internal format, I think | |
| 04:07 | eythian | yes, a query tree would be good. |
| 04:07 | dcook | What do you mean about everything being computer generated? |
| 04:07 | eythian | well, there's no human typing a search term |
| 04:07 | so I don't have to deal with rubbish input | |
| 04:07 | so if I can move it around in some sane format, that's good. | |
| 04:07 | dcook | Mmm I think I get you |
| 04:07 | Hmm | |
| 04:08 | Definitely take a look at OpenILS::QueryParser | |
| 04:09 | and the Koha::QueryParser modules | |
| 04:09 | eythian | http://perldoc.koha-community.[…]/QueryParser.html <--it's underdocumented |
| 04:09 | cdickinphone_ joined #koha | |
| 04:09 | dcook | Yeah, I spent hours just tearing it apart because of the lack of documentation :/ |
| 04:09 | eythian | it doesn't even have a copyright header :/ |
| 04:10 | dcook | It's certainly suboptimal :( |
| 04:10 | I'm amazed that someone was able to keep it all in their head without documentation to be honest | |
| 04:11 | But you could probably reverse-engineer what jcamins did? | |
| 04:13 | eythian | I could |
| 04:13 | cdickinphone_ joined #koha | |
| 04:13 | eythian | but I'm not sure it's not a waste of time |
| 04:13 | dcook | Yeah, I know that feeling |
| 04:14 | If the QueryParser were already an integral part of Koha, I'd say it would be a requirement | |
| 04:14 | But since it's not... | |
| 04:14 | eythian | yeah |
| 04:14 | dcook | I'd look at the "decompose" function in QueryParser.pm |
| 04:15 | eythian | if it had a nice bit somewhere saying what it does, that'd be a pleasant start. |
| 04:15 | dcook | For sure |
| 04:15 | eythian | then I'd at least know if I was searching the right place. |
| 04:15 | dcook | $self->new_plan |
| 04:16 | $struct->add_node | |
| 04:17 | classed_node | |
| 04:18 | I'm not sure how "top_plan" or "plan_level" factor in | |
| 04:18 | eythian | I don't know what any of that is :) |
| 04:19 | dcook | Ah, I'm just looking through "decompose" |
| 04:19 | Which decomposes a free-form text string | |
| 04:19 | I figure it's output is the same output that you'd want to generate | |
| 04:19 | I recall atoms also being important | |
| 04:19 | eythian | yeah, that would make sense |
| 04:20 | dcook | Hmm I see something about abstract queries. That would be good.. |
| 04:20 | eythian | if only it actually said somewhere what it is that it returns |
| 04:20 | dcook | Bah, kids these days. They want everything written out for them! |
| 04:20 | eythian | heh |
| 04:20 | dcook | In my day, everything was written in Greek, and we just hoped it worked! |
| 04:21 | cdickinson joined #koha | |
| 04:21 | eythian | screw it, I'm going to just make up a simple form that'll do the job now, and note that whoever failed to document the queryparser can be the person to convert it to use that in the future. |
| 04:24 | dcook | I think it might go "query_plan" -> "node" -> "atom" |
| 04:24 | Yeah, I can't fault you for that | |
| 04:24 | I sometimes wonder if the upstream Query Parser has been improved | |
| 04:26 | http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?[…]863332ba8;hb=HEAD | |
| 04:26 | I'm guessing perhaps not | |
| 04:26 | Last modified 2013-11-26 | |
| 04:27 | That's actually sort of heartening I think | |
| 04:27 | Besides the lack of documentation :/ | |
| 04:27 | eythian | heh yeah |
| 04:28 | dcook | You know... might be an idea to chat to Mike Rylander about it |
| 04:28 | That might be the easiest way to do it | |
| 04:29 | Anywho, I should probably work on something else atm | |
| 04:29 | sorry I couldn't help more, eythian :/ | |
| 04:29 | eythian | s'ok. I was just hopeful that there was something sensible there I could use, but it seems not :) |
| 04:30 | dcook | I have no doubt there is, but it would be time consuming to discover it :/ |
| 04:36 | AmitG joined #koha | |
| 04:38 | dcook | Oh man... it feels like ages since I've done any web design |
| 04:38 | I can't say I've missed it.. | |
| 04:41 | eythian | http://paste.koha-community.org/35 <-- dcook, what I ended up with instead. |
| 04:42 | it basically fufills my current needs and not a whole lot more :) | |
| 04:42 | dcook | mtj and chrisvella are one in the same?! |
| 04:42 | eythian | I always thought so |
| 04:42 | chrisvella | hahaha |
| 04:43 | dcook | eythian: Looks like it does the trick |
| 04:43 | chrisvella | mtj is playing around with nicks in our own channel |
| 04:43 | mtj | shush dcook :0) |
| 04:43 | chrisvella | or he has chrisvella_ as a spy... who knows ;) |
| 04:43 | dcook | You guys have a lot of channels, eh? ;p |
| 04:44 | chrisvella | hahaha |
| 04:44 | dcook | eythian: I had to do something similar a little while back making a basic Koha search API |
| 04:44 | Koha definitely needs more coherent search in every way.. | |
| 04:44 | eythian | yeah, it's something we ought to have standard formats for really |
| 04:44 | dcook | For sure |
| 04:45 | So how are you going to handle regular free form search queries? | |
| 04:46 | eythian | http://git.catalyst.net.nz/gw?[…]astic_search#l155 <-- at the moment, I don't have to as the compatibility functions do that. |
| 04:51 | dcook | Ahhh right |
| 04:51 | I think I saw that a while back | |
| 04:58 | chrisvella joined #koha | |
| 05:00 | chrisvella joined #koha | |
| 05:04 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 05:06 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 05:12 | gavitor joined #koha | |
| 05:24 | gavitor joined #koha | |
| 05:26 | gavitor | Hello all....I am a new user and having successfully installed KOHA 3.20 on Monday I have found that I can't log on properly today... |
| 05:34 | AmitG joined #koha | |
| 05:35 | gavitor | Anyone getting my feed? I am having internet connectivity issues currently....... |
| 05:46 | cdickinphone joined #koha | |
| 05:47 | drojf joined #koha | |
| 05:47 | drojf | morning #koha |
| 05:47 | Francesca | morning |
| 05:48 | drojf | hi Francesca |
| 05:48 | @wunder berlin, germany | |
| 05:48 | huginn` | drojf: The current temperature in Berlin Tegel, Germany is 17.0°C (7:20 AM CEST on August 05, 2015). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 88%. Dew Point: 15.0°C. Pressure: 30.09 in 1019 hPa (Rising). |
| 05:48 | Francesca | @wunder wlg |
| 05:48 | huginn` | Francesca: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 11.0°C (5:30 PM NZST on August 05, 2015). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 67%. Dew Point: 5.0°C. Pressure: 29.92 in 1013 hPa (Steady). |
| 05:49 | drojf | much cooler today. and my flat is back to a normal temperature :) |
| 05:49 | gavitor | Hello? |
| 05:49 | exit | |
| 05:49 | gavitor left #koha | |
| 05:50 | Francesca | that is good |
| 05:55 | * Francesca | is now writing an essay on cats |
| 06:04 | drojf | as a music major? |
| 06:05 | cdickinphone | ^ lol |
| 06:05 | I do Japanese, as an Engineering major | |
| 06:06 | chrisvella joined #koha | |
| 06:09 | drojf | in german, we have the word "katzenmusik" (literally 'cat music') for cacophony, and for something that apparently is called 'rough music' in english https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rough_music |
| 06:16 | * liw | is wearing a t-shirt saying "Eine kleine Tasse Schokoladenschnitzel mit Bananenkartoffeln und Kabelsalat auf der Hauptbahnhof, bitte" and should probably stay out of this discussion |
| 06:20 | cdickinphone joined #koha | |
| 06:21 | Francesca | don't laugh at me |
| 06:21 | I may be a music major, but the cat essay is not for a music paper | |
| 06:21 | its for my writing elective | |
| 06:23 | Joubu joined #koha | |
| 06:23 | Joubu | morning #koha |
| 06:27 | Francesca | morning Joubu |
| 06:32 | dcook | That moment when you sit back down and try to remember what you were doing.. |
| 06:32 | Ah right.. | |
| 06:33 | cait joined #koha | |
| 06:33 | cait | @wunder Konstanz |
| 06:33 | huginn` | cait: The current temperature in Bodensee Konstanz City, Konstanz, Germany is 20.7°C (8:32 AM CEST on August 05, 2015). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 67%. Dew Point: 14.0°C. Pressure: 30.09 in 1019 hPa (Steady). |
| 06:33 | dcook | @wunder syd |
| 06:33 | heya cait | |
| 06:33 | huginn` | dcook: The current temperature in Sydney, New South Wales is 16.0°C (4:00 PM AEST on August 05, 2015). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 31%. Dew Point: -1.0°C. Pressure: 29.83 in 1010 hPa (Steady). |
| 06:37 | cdickinphone_ joined #koha | |
| 06:39 | p_vdk joined #koha | |
| 06:40 | p_vdk left #koha | |
| 06:41 | Francesca | hey cait, dcook |
| 06:41 | cait | if it stayed at 20... there would be no problem |
| 06:41 | supposed to go over 30 agan this week :( | |
| 06:41 | Francesca | dcook: I have a topic for my essay now! |
| 06:41 | dcook | Francesca: Nice :) |
| 06:41 | cait: :( | |
| 06:41 | Francesca | Its about cats |
| 06:42 | dcook | Can't go wrong with cats |
| 06:42 | Or maybe you can! | |
| 06:42 | What's the debate? | |
| 06:42 | Francesca | cait: I could send you my fanpen |
| 06:42 | dcook | Reminds me that I haven't seen gmcharlt around here in ages... |
| 06:42 | Francesca | dcook: Should cats be exterminated so as the preserve wildlife in nz |
| 06:42 | or should they be left alone, but have more regulations | |
| 06:43 | * dcook | isn't a pet person despite having two cats |
| 06:43 | cait | Francesca: :) |
| 06:43 | brb | |
| 06:43 | cait left #koha | |
| 06:44 | Francesca | dcook: you have cats but you're not a cat person?? |
| 06:45 | cdickinphone_ | He might have a significant other that calls the shots on that one |
| 06:46 | Francesca | hahaha |
| 06:46 | ok | |
| 06:47 | cdickinphone joined #koha | |
| 06:48 | dcook | Francesca: Technically they're my wife's cats :p |
| 06:48 | indradg joined #koha | |
| 06:48 | dcook | cdickinphone_: hehe yep |
| 06:48 | They are adorable though | |
| 06:48 | cdickinphone | Whoop |
| 06:48 | dcook | I feel like that sums up my feelings about them :p |
| 06:48 | jseplae joined #koha | |
| 06:50 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 06:50 | Francesca | cats are adorable |
| 06:50 | my are particularly adorable | |
| 06:50 | *mine | |
| 06:51 | hey cdickinphone_ check this out | |
| 06:51 | wahanui: cats | |
| 06:51 | wahanui | cats are endlessly entertaining. |
| 06:52 | cdickinphone | A cat person then |
| 06:52 | Francesca | cat bot might be a better description |
| 06:58 | gaetan_B joined #koha | |
| 06:58 | gaetan_B | hello |
| 06:58 | wahanui | bidet, gaetan_B |
| 06:58 | chrisvella_ joined #koha | |
| 07:01 | drojf | in serials, if i use 'manual history', does that mean nothing is filledinautomatically? i set up a subscription and received a few issues, but if i choose 'edit history' it's empty. is it supposed to be? |
| 07:03 | alex_a joined #koha | |
| 07:04 | alex_a | bonjour |
| 07:06 | cait joined #koha | |
| 07:06 | dcook | drojf: Can't remember. Sorry :/ |
| 07:08 | Francesca | @wunder wlg |
| 07:08 | huginn` | Francesca: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 9.0°C (7:00 PM NZST on August 05, 2015). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 76%. Dew Point: 5.0°C. Pressure: 29.89 in 1012 hPa (Steady). |
| 07:11 | Jul joined #koha | |
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| 07:16 | drojf | not translatable either :/ |
| 07:20 | laurence joined #koha | |
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| 08:27 | kivilahtio | Joubu: the way you partitioned Koha::Acquisition::Bookseller::Contact is very good! |
| 08:27 | Joubu++ | |
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| 08:47 | nlegrand | hello #koha |
| 08:48 | Francesca | hello |
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| 08:49 | Francesca | hey cdickinson |
| 08:49 | wahanui | I run Windows. Don't judge me. |
| 08:49 | cait | ew |
| 08:49 | ;) | |
| 08:49 | Francesca | cait: are you judging him yet? |
| 08:49 | (the wellington team so totally is) | |
| 08:54 | cait | i am using windows at work too :) |
| 08:54 | cdickinson | why hello there, Francesca |
| 08:54 | cait | but ubuntu at home and debian for my dev environment here |
| 08:54 | ... so hardly in a position to give him a hard time really | |
| 08:54 | cdickinson | do I get a pass simply for being too lazy to replace it with Linux? :P |
| 08:55 | Francesca | hehehehe |
| 08:55 | cait | ok, now i am judging you ;) |
| 08:55 | Francesca | I run mac don't judge me |
| 08:55 | cdickinson | lol |
| 08:55 | Francesca | but I have a vm with ubuntu installed |
| 08:55 | cdickinson | have countless Ubuntu VMs for many different things here |
| 08:55 | and live in shells | |
| 08:55 | Francesca | lol |
| 08:55 | cdickinson the shell dweller | |
| 08:56 | cdickinson | oh boy |
| 08:56 | Francesca | hehehehe |
| 08:56 | wahanui roger that? | |
| 08:56 | wahanui | aye aye cap'n |
| 08:56 | nlegrand | I have been using OpenBSD for a long time and juged everyone else. Now I'm on Debian and I feel like a hippie. |
| 08:56 | cdickinson | don't you do what I think you're going to do |
| 08:57 | Francesca | I'm not going to do anything |
| 08:57 | cdickinson | literal cdickinson |
| 08:57 | wahanui | cdickinson: cdickinson =is= <reply> I run Windows. Don't judge me.|a Linux admin who runs Windows. (blasphemer.)|<reply> cdickinson's worst fear is the worst fear of every programmer - the silent server fail |
| 08:57 | Francesca | cdickinson: look up |
| 08:57 | I haven't done anything see? | |
| 08:57 | cdickinson | that pirate thing is clever |
| 08:58 | Francesca | I couldn't resist |
| 08:58 | anyways | |
| 08:58 | * Francesca | should return to her cat essay |
| 08:58 | cdickinson | is it coming along? :P |
| 08:58 | Francesca | ish |
| 09:00 | who knew writing about cats could be so hard | |
| 09:01 | cdickinson | because you're probably not writing about how cute cats are :P |
| 09:01 | Francesca | nope |
| 09:01 | don't think that'd pass somehow | |
| 09:01 | I'll send you the draft another day | |
| 09:02 | cdickinson | yeah, I'll proof read it for you |
| 09:02 | is it about the wild cats that basically become pests? | |
| 09:04 | Francesca | you'll see |
| 09:05 | cdickinson | in that case, I'll look forward to it |
| 09:05 | it has to be finished for that, though :P | |
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| 10:42 | * Francesca | does a happy dance |
| 10:42 | Francesca | essay is finished! |
| 10:42 | now to bed | |
| 10:42 | goodnight | |
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| 11:14 | gaetan_B | bye |
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| 11:55 | nikesh | join #koha |
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| 12:33 | misilot | is there an easy way to mass modify course reserve? (ie a list of barcodes remove from any course they are attached to?) |
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| 12:40 | Joubu | misilot: Not using the interface |
| 12:41 | tcohen | hi #koha |
| 12:41 | misilot | Joubu: :( |
| 12:41 | Joubu | tcohen: o/ |
| 12:41 | tcohen | hi Joubu |
| 12:42 | Joubu: what's your first thought about bug 14598? Maybe we should extract the regression tests for the original bug? | |
| 12:42 | huginn` | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=14598 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Signed Off , itemtype is not set on statistics by C4::Circulation::AddReturn |
| 12:43 | Joubu | tcohen: it seems to work, but itemtypes make me crazy... |
| 12:44 | I never know if everything is correctly checked | |
| 12:44 | tcohen: lunch time ;) | |
| 12:44 | tcohen | no no |
| 12:44 | waiiiit | |
| 12:44 | heh | |
| 12:47 | cait | |
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| 13:08 | tcohen | gmcharlt: around? |
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| 13:09 | gmcharlt | tcohen: hmm? |
| 13:09 | tcohen | gmcharlt: bug 9351 vs. bug 14598 |
| 13:09 | huginn` | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9351 major, P5 - low, ---, fridolin.somers, Failed QA , item type not recorded correctly in statistics for returns and some local use |
| 13:09 | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=14598 normal, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Signed Off , itemtype is not set on statistics by C4::Circulation::AddReturn | |
| 13:09 | tcohen | I missed frido's, but I'm not happy with the patches either |
| 13:10 | you have more insight on how we deal with itemtypes, can you take a look? | |
| 13:10 | gmcharlt | looking |
| 13:10 | tcohen | i'm adding my opinion on frido's |
| 13:11 | Shane-S | Hi all, I had to switch to DOM...followed http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]g_to_dom_indexing. I got all my errors sorted, and checked system info...no issues there....however... |
| 13:11 | tcohen | gmcharlt: done |
| 13:11 | Shane-S | Now I get: Error: Can't call method "raw" on an undefined value at /usr/share/koha/lib/C4/Search.pm line 799. when I do a search |
| 13:11 | nengard | hi all |
| 13:11 | tcohen | hi nengard |
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| 13:17 | * tcohen | blinks |
| 13:18 | tcohen | CanBookBeIssued... is used... to record localuse loans... *blink* |
| 13:20 | kivilahtio | tcohen: nice! That is something I would love to hear when returning from a loong holiday |
| 13:20 | I might crawl back to where I came from | |
| 13:21 | tcohen | kivilahtio: sarcasm is discouraged here |
| 13:21 | kivilahtio | boy if that had a regression test |
| 13:21 | hey but I do! | |
| 13:21 | tcohen: sorry to ruin your day but I came here to complain/discuss | |
| 13:22 | gmcharlt | tcohen: reaction 1 - 14598 lacks an explicit test of the item-levels_itypes systpref, and since GetItems() doesn't do it... |
| 13:22 | tcohen | heh |
| 13:22 | kivilahtio | I have been working with these Koha::Objects and mainly accessing referenced tables |
| 13:22 | Shane-S | so I rebooted...and the C4 error went away |
| 13:22 | Joubu | Shane-S: Have you reindexed? |
| 13:22 | kivilahtio | and that is very hard :) |
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| 13:22 | Shane-S | Joubu: I did before the restart as per the DOM conversion Wiki...seems fine now |
| 13:23 | gmcharlt | tcohen: reaction two - same thing for bug 9351 |
| 13:23 | huginn` | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]w_bug.cgi?id=9351 major, P5 - low, ---, fridolin.somers, Failed QA , item type not recorded correctly in statistics for returns and some local use |
| 13:23 | kivilahtio | has anybody done any performance tests with Koha::Object vs DBIx::Class related to referenced table access? |
| 13:23 | Shane-S | I have another Question, the PERL tab in About Koha reports 4 things yellow, and 2 red...how can I get PERL to add the missing or warnings? |
| 13:23 | gmcharlt | tcohen: upshot - please poke me tomorrow and I will emit a counter-patch for discussion |
| 13:23 | tcohen | gmcharlt: you mean you will extend the regression tests? |
| 13:24 | kivilahtio | Looking at the code, it feels like O(n) * O(n) * O(n) is starting to add up |
| 13:24 | well, just asking, take care! | |
| 13:24 | tcohen | i noticed on writing the tests, that if bib-level itypes are set, the bib-level itype is recorded on the item |
| 13:25 | gmcharlt: C4/Items.pm:179-183 | |
| 13:26 | so the item always carries an itemtype | |
| 13:27 | gmcharlt | tcohen: but in the case where item-level_itypes is off, but the items.itemtype is populated... it returns the item-level type |
| 13:27 | when the expecation is that it return the bib-level type | |
| 13:27 | i.e., not quite the same thing | |
| 13:27 | see C4::Circulation::TooMany() for an example of the logic I have in mind | |
| 13:28 | tcohen | ok |
| 13:28 | gmcharlt | or line 622 in Koha/Schema/Result/Item.pm |
| 13:29 | tcohen | gmcharlt: i see what you mean, but I suspect that belongs to a separate bug |
| 13:30 | * tcohen | means that for fixing GetItem |
| 13:30 | Joubu | tcohen: khall did something will an "effective_ittemtype" or something |
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| 13:30 | tcohen | yes, that's what gmcharlt pointed about the schema |
| 13:30 | Joubu | indeed |
| 13:31 | gmcharlt | tcohen: yeah, arguably changing GetItem() is a separate bug |
| 13:31 | but a local fix to AddReturn() can be done in parallel | |
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| 13:32 | tcohen | Maybe sub GetItem { my $itemnumber = shift; return Koha::Item->search({ itemnumber => $itemnumber }) } |
| 13:32 | gmcharlt | it occurs to me that clearest change to GetItem() would be to have it add an effective_itemtype to its return value |
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| 13:34 | tcohen | gmcharlt: i will post a followup with explicit tests for the case bl-itype && il-itype are defined for the item, and bl-itype is set, could you please review it? |
| 13:34 | gmcharlt | will do |
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| 13:48 | Shane-S | can I jus do cpan upgrade (/(.*)/ or something like that, or do the Perl modules need to be handle individually? I installed from packages back like 3.08 then to 3.12 and now from 3.12-> 3.20 and apt-get isn't touching Perl |
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| 14:01 | tcohen | kivilahtio: weren't you about to complain about something? |
| 14:01 | kivilahtio | tcohen: I am worried about the Koha::Object system and that it I am starting to see things with it |
| 14:01 | tcohen | kivilahtio: elaborate, did you find limitations? |
| 14:01 | kivilahtio | tcohen: they way we access linked resources from one object will sooner or later lead to circular references |
| 14:02 | tcohen: also I feel dump rewriting the exact same code DBIx enables, but DBIx prolly takes care of the circular references issues for u | |
| 14:02 | we should inherit the Koha/Schema/Result/Object | |
| 14:02 | this would lead to much much more prettier code | |
| 14:03 | implementing these Koha::Object subclasses is no easier than with DBI | |
| 14:03 | you have to implement a separate subroutine to access linked resources even if DBIx would do it for us, that is a lot of extra code we need writing. | |
| 14:03 | and my fingers are starting to hurt and I don't want to do that anymore | |
| 14:04 | so instead of saying $subscription->_result()->numberpattern(); | |
| 14:04 | we can just say $subscription->numberpattern() calling the DBIx | |
| 14:05 | and we don't cache the linked resource in the Koha::Object-implementations $self->{linkedresource} | |
| 14:06 | for ex if koha.biblio and koha.biblioitems for the same biblionumber get their biblio and biblioitems invoked using these Koha::Object relational accessors we get a circular reference and that wont get garbage collected unless we explicitly destroy the linkings | |
| 14:06 | we cannot destroy the linkings if we lose the references to the biblios | |
| 14:07 | this hapened to me when doing our data migration scripts. Man it was painful to track circular references | |
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| 14:07 | kivilahtio | also I rewrite what DBIx already does for us |
| 14:07 | Joubu | kivilahtio: the thing is we almost agree on Koha::Object after 4 years of "discussion" |
| 14:07 | ok it's not perfect, but at least we have something into master | |
| 14:08 | feel free to suggest something else | |
| 14:08 | kivilahtio | Joubu: I am thinking of it |
| 14:08 | Joubu: I am not saying Koha::Object is a bad thing, but I would have like somebody to actually write real production code with it before pushing it to master | |
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| 14:09 | Joubu | what is "real production code"? |
| 14:09 | kivilahtio | and encoutner real issues you are bound to face when working with multiple referencing objects, like biblio-biblioitems and subscriptions |
| 14:09 | Joubu: something which actually does something more complex in production thatn just search/find | |
| 14:10 | Joubu: I don't feel ok with Koha::Object. I think I will try a tech sprint by doing multiple inheritance with DBIx and Koha::Object | |
| 14:11 | something like "use base qw(Koha::Object Koha/Schema/Result/Subscription);" | |
| 14:11 | Joubu | bug 13726, bug 14544, bug 11431 |
| 14:11 | huginn` | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=13726 normal, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Needs Signoff , Koha::Acquisition::Bookseller should use Koha::Object |
| 14:11 | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=14544 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, In Discussion , Move the list related code to Koha::Virtualshelves | |
| 14:11 | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=11431 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle, Failed QA , Add additional sound options for warnings | |
| 14:12 | kivilahtio | +sub baskets { |
| 14:12 | + return $self->{_result}->aqbaskets; | |
| 14:15 | Joubu | yes I know: it's not elegant, but extendable. |
| 14:16 | I meant, if you manage to clean pl file and add readable code : my $baskets = Koha::Booksellers->find($id)->baskets | |
| 14:16 | you will be able to replace Koha::Booksellers with what you like | |
| 14:16 | no need to rewrite the callers | |
| 14:17 | kivilahtio: really if you have a good option, I will be the first to be happy | |
| 14:17 | kivilahtio | Joubu: thanks for the feedback |
| 14:17 | I am thinking :) | |
| 14:19 | Joubu | kivilahtio: no matter if we have a layer with stupid methods like that. To me it's not important, just because it will be easy to fix when we will find a global fix |
| 14:19 | kivilahtio | Joubu: we have to change every Koha::Object subclass ecause the code is each object references getter |
| 14:20 | sub contacts { | |
| 14:20 | $self->{contacts} = Koha::Acquisition::Bookseller::Contacts->search( { booksellerid => $self->id } ); | |
| 14:20 | return $self->{contacts}; | |
| 14:20 | if contacts has similar subroutine which returns the object getting the contacts | |
| 14:20 | and they both store a reference to each others... | |
| 14:20 | and I see this pattern everywhere | |
| 14:21 | this is not something you fix with DBIx or Koha::Object, you have to refactor every subroutine with this programming pattern. | |
| 14:21 | I am no DBIx expert, frankly I barely get by, but I think DBIx will deal with this mess for us | |
| 14:21 | Joubu | that's why you have to provide a fix quickly!! :) |
| 14:21 | kivilahtio | and do a lot of extra magic |
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| 14:25 | cait | hmif someone talked to me in the last hour..... my irc client died and with it all the messages - please resent *sigh* |
| 14:25 | wnickc joined #koha | |
| 14:26 | nengard | hola wnickc |
| 14:26 | are you at kohana | |
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| 14:30 | tcohen | kivilahtio: you can either: provide a fix to Koha::Object(s), and/or stick with DBIx for that specific project from yours, when we adopted Koha::Object(s) is was explicitly stated that it wouldn't be mandatory to use them. |
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| 14:31 | tcohen | the only mandatory guideline we embraced was not using plain SQL anymore |
| 14:31 | and we don't follow it (if you look at updatedatabase.pl) :-P | |
| 14:33 | kivilahtio | tcohen: reading you loud and clear |
| 14:33 | wnickc | I am, no power near me so running on my phone and checking sporadically |
| 14:34 | Khall is doing a nice job of recording on the Bywater blog | |
| 14:35 | cait | wnickc: are you at kohana? |
| 14:36 | oh | |
| 14:36 | missed nengards question - don't answer | |
| 14:36 | wnickc | Hi cait |
| 14:36 | nengard | wnickc heather is doing a great job reporting on her own blog too |
| 14:36 | I keep linking to her :) | |
| 14:37 | * cait | hopes for lots of testing of the new cataloguing editor |
| 14:37 | wnickc | Not surprising, she is good at that, I can just see Kyle doing the blog from my chair |
| 14:47 | Anyone know what flagged does in frameworks | |
| 14:51 | nengard | um .... |
| 14:52 | wnickc in what context? | |
| 14:52 | I don't see it in the db or eding a framework | |
| 14:53 | wnickc | Editing a subfield, under avdanced constraints with visibility |
| 14:53 | nengard | OH!!! |
| 14:53 | um .... hehe | |
| 14:54 | apparently the documentation manager had no clue cause she didn't include it in the manual | |
| 14:54 | anyone else know?? | |
| 14:54 | tcohen cait? | |
| 14:55 | tcohen | hi |
| 14:55 | wahanui | salut, tcohen |
| 14:55 | wnickc | There is a mention in the help for the page, but only says it is exclusive to all other options |
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| 14:56 | cait | nengard: i think noone knows |
| 14:56 | nengard | well that's encouraging |
| 14:56 | hehe | |
| 14:56 | * nengard | is being sarcastic |
| 14:56 | cait | we'd have to read the code to see if the numeric hidden value it translates too has actually an effect |
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| 15:04 | tcohen | gmcharlt: do u remember what is supposed to be the behaviour when item.itemtype is NULL? fallback to biblio-level itype? |
| 15:05 | kivilahtio | tcohen: item.ccode? |
| 15:05 | prolly not :( | |
| 15:06 | cait | nope |
| 15:06 | i think some of the code falls back to bibio.itemtype | |
| 15:06 | but ... not sure that's consistently so | |
| 15:06 | tcohen | and some doesn't :-D |
| 15:06 | cait | most likely |
| 15:06 | i'd think it would make some sense to have it fallback | |
| 15:08 | tcohen | ok, i'll fill a new bug... |
| 15:08 | damn | |
| 15:08 | sorry | |
| 15:08 | * tcohen | ends blasphemous mode |
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| 15:31 | pianohacker | morning |
| 15:33 | nengard | hi pianohacker |
| 15:33 | tcohen | hi pianohacker |
| 15:35 | kivilahtio | tcohen: Joubu: Ran some tests and the circular referencing object are actually different objects, even if they represent the same business data. |
| 15:35 | gmcharlt | tcohen: cait: falling back across the board would be... new behavior |
| 15:35 | kivilahtio | so there is no circular reference when using DBIx or Koha::Object. |
| 15:35 | sorry for getting hyped up. | |
| 15:36 | gmcharlt | general idea is that if you set item-level_itypes, one *must* always set an item type for each item |
| 15:36 | kivilahtio | The downside is that DBIx doesnät do caching, or it summons a completely new resultset object for all of these different objects. Thus we don't get any caching |
| 15:37 | gmcharlt | (not that falling back to bib-level is an inherently silly notion -- not at all -- but it wouldn't be universally expected either, and we're in a situation where we've got the dead weight of history to deal with) |
| 15:37 | kivilahtio | and if we update one referenced version of the same business data the changes wont propagate to the other existing implementation. Not sure if that is bad, but it is inefficient. |
| 15:38 | Joubu | Have to go, have a good day/evening #koha |
| 15:38 | gmcharlt | (as well as various interpretations, each of which individually is sensible, but collectively are too inconsistent to bear) |
| 15:38 | kivilahtio | anyway. Just saying that there should be no circular reference issues with the way we currently get referenced objects. |
| 15:38 | tcohen | bye Joubu ! |
| 15:38 | kivilahtio | bye! |
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| 15:42 | pianohacker | kivilahtio: so in other words, $item->biblio()->items()->[0], say, would not get you back to $item? |
| 15:42 | Koha_User | Hello |
| 15:42 | wahanui | bidet, Koha_User |
| 15:43 | Koha_User | Where can i find apache? |
| 15:43 | wahanui | apache is probably the ram hog |
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| 15:43 | kivilahtio | pianohacker: it gets you back to a basically cloned object of the original item |
| 15:43 | which is cloned in the biblio-object | |
| 15:44 | it has the same data. | |
| 15:44 | pianohacker | right, same data but different object |
| 15:44 | kivilahtio | thus no circular reference |
| 15:44 | but also expensive DB calls for something which DBIx should automatically cache in the process memory | |
| 15:48 | pianohacker: you could do:: $item->biblio($biblio); $biblio->addItem($item); Which might get us into trouble | |
| 15:49 | pianohacker | kivilahtio: hmm, yeah, technically redundant but might create a circular reference |
| 15:50 | kivilahtio | Apparently DBIx doesnt do transparent caching?? I am surprised to find an ORM that doesn't. |
| 15:50 | Well how goes the saying? "Assume, makes an ass out of you and me" :) | |
| 15:51 | pianohacker | caching has the potential to create enough weird issues, especially in Perl, that they probably want to make sure you know what you're doing |
| 15:53 | kivilahtio | pianohacker: can you elaborate that a bit? |
| 15:53 | what do you mean? | |
| 15:58 | Kchris | I have been trying to set up a development/testing environment with kohadevbox. I have had Koha running on it at times, but sometimes "vagrant up" fails. I am not really clear why.I get error messages such as "File [/home/vagrant/kohaclone/koha_perl_deps.pl] is not executable! |
| 15:58 | jgabin | hello! |
| 15:59 | kivilahtio | Kchris: sorry, I don't know anything about Vagrant. We use pure LXC. It works :) |
| 15:59 | jgabin | I have a question about reserves |
| 16:00 | When a reserve is waiting, and this reserve is expired, there is a cronjob that cancel this reserve, but, the next one, that has priority 1 is not set as W. Do I have to set it manually or there is a cron that do this job? | |
| 16:01 | Kchris | kivilahtio: where would one get started with LXC? |
| 16:02 | kivilahtio | Kchris: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LXC |
| 16:02 | Kchris: but I would ask around some more about Vagrant | |
| 16:02 | don't ditch it just yet, if you have made some investment in learning it | |
| 16:02 | Kchris: we use LXC because I don't need any extra middleware to debug, like with Vagrant or Docker or whatnot | |
| 16:03 | cait | @later tell drojf noooooooooooooo - now you are gone and i want to know! |
| 16:03 | huginn` | cait: The operation succeeded. |
| 16:03 | kivilahtio | Kchris: LXC is actually dead easy |
| 16:03 | configuring the nwtworking is more challenging and you need to know about iptables and friends to get it working | |
| 16:04 | but if you want something that can access the internet and doesnät need to be exposed to the public, it is very easy | |
| 16:04 | like having development environments for different versions of linux, or different versions of Koha | |
| 16:07 | bye #koha | |
| 16:07 | you are precious :) | |
| 16:10 | AmitG joined #koha | |
| 16:18 | Kchris | kivilahtio: thanks for the pointers. |
| 16:23 | jgabin | Anyone could help me? :( |
| 16:23 | When a reserve is waiting, and this reserve is expired, there is a cronjob that cancel this reserve, but, the next one, that has priority 1 is not set as W. Do I have to set it manually or there is a cron that do this job? | |
| 16:26 | laurence left #koha | |
| 16:59 | drojf joined #koha | |
| 17:20 | eythian joined #koha | |
| 17:20 | indradg joined #koha | |
| 17:28 | cait left #koha | |
| 17:37 | tcohen | hi |
| 17:37 | wahanui | bonjour, tcohen |
| 17:51 | huginn joined #koha | |
| 17:57 | indradg | hello #koha |
| 17:57 | @seen khall | |
| 17:57 | huginn | indradg: khall was last seen in #koha 1 day, 5 hours, 34 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <khall> sounds like a good plan |
| 18:03 | pianohacker | indradg: Kyle is currently at the Koha NA user's group meeting, and may not respond until next week |
| 18:04 | worth leaving a later though, he may check in | |
| 18:04 | indradg | pianohacker: i know... bag asked me to ping him here :) |
| 18:04 | pianohacker | oh hahaha okay :) |
| 18:06 | indradg | @later tell khall was wondering if the KohaNA 2015 sessions were being recorded/podcasted/transcripted now or anytime later? |
| 18:06 | huginn | indradg: The operation succeeded. |
| 18:22 | mtompset joined #koha | |
| 18:22 | mtompset | Greetings, #koha. |
| 18:23 | @seen tcohen | |
| 18:23 | huginn | mtompset: tcohen was last seen in #koha 45 minutes and 58 seconds ago: <tcohen> hi |
| 18:23 | tcohen | hi mtompset |
| 18:23 | mtompset | I noticed the CC on the bug... I figured that means, I just don't attempt anything on 11592 until the underlying tech stops moving on me. :P |
| 18:24 | tcohen | bug 11592 |
| 18:24 | huginn | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=11592 major, P3, ---, mtompset, In Discussion , opac detail scripts do not respect MARC tag visibility |
| 18:24 | tcohen | what underllying tech? |
| 18:24 | mtompset | tech/structures/objects/schemas. |
| 18:24 | tcohen | my CC was so you test and sign :-D and we have the tech |
| 18:25 | mtompset | Ah. |
| 18:25 | I'm noting the needs sign offs is gone almost to 200. | |
| 18:25 | @seen gmcharlt | |
| 18:25 | huginn | mtompset: gmcharlt was last seen in #koha 2 hours, 47 minutes, and 42 seconds ago: <gmcharlt> (as well as various interpretations, each of which individually is sensible, but collectively are too inconsistent to bear) |
| 18:25 | tcohen | i didn't finish making the Koha::RecordProcessor changes to make it handle Koha::MetadataRecord object properly, but i'm almost done |
| 18:27 | mtompset | Which reminds me... I should bug report that... |
| 18:27 | Recall our discussion about how to fix up Koha::RecordProcessor? | |
| 18:28 | Your solution was to add filter as a second parameter. | |
| 18:28 | My solution was to fix the string/object issue in the initialize call area. | |
| 18:28 | Both are needed for ultimate flexibility. | |
| 18:31 | tcohen | mtompset: filter? wasn't it about the options? |
| 18:31 | mtompset | params. |
| 18:31 | Perhaps options. | |
| 18:32 | The variable names are confusing. :P | |
| 18:32 | tcohen | i know |
| 18:32 | mtompset: my plan is that instead of passing just MARC::Record objects (or XML::LibXML::Document, or JSON) | |
| 18:32 | we will now pass Koha::MetadataRecord objects | |
| 18:33 | that carry more information about themselves | |
| 18:33 | mtompset | Which makes sense, I suppose. |
| 18:33 | Oh... tcohen I have a suggestion regarding bug 14639 | |
| 18:33 | huginn | 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org[…]_bug.cgi?id=14639 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, tomascohen, Needs Signoff , Extend Koha::MetadataRecord to handle serialization format |
| 18:33 | mtompset | Include error checking for incorrect call format. |
| 18:33 | blah::new vs. blah->new | |
| 18:34 | tcohen | what? |
| 18:34 | no, don't bomb the bug, just sign it! | |
| 18:34 | mtompset | Koha::MetadataRecord is an object and should be called blah->new |
| 18:34 | indradg joined #koha | |
| 18:35 | mtompset | but some newbie programmer might blah::new |
| 18:35 | tcohen | once we have this pushed, fill all the bugs you want to enhance it |
| 18:35 | mtompset | I'll sign the bug off, but that extra check would be nice to prevent stupid coder mistakes. |
| 18:35 | pianohacker | mtompset: that's a universal issue, and not one that I think we should feel responsible for |
| 18:36 | There's sanity checking and there's knowing Perl OOP :) | |
| 18:36 | tcohen | hehehe |
| 18:36 | mtompset | checking that $self is the right class is a reasonable sanity check. :P |
| 18:37 | But, yes, an enhancement for later. | |
| 18:38 | tcohen | mtompset: if we were to do that kind of check on OO code in the Koha codebase, we could even hook it rewriting some Perl bits in runtime so we don't write that on all the files |
| 18:40 | oh my | |
| 18:42 | @later tell gmcharlt I updated the bug, please let me know if the tests are what you had in mind. I like them and the solution makes real sense | |
| 18:42 | huginn | tcohen: The operation succeeded. |
| 18:42 | mtompset | oh my? |
| 18:43 | tcohen | i cannot name him in vain |
| 18:43 | mtompset | oh my gmcharlt? |
| 18:43 | :) | |
| 18:44 | tcohen | i had issues rebuilding zerba indexes for authorities on one instance |
| 18:45 | and it turned out that if I run rebuild_zebra.pl manually, with -x it works | |
| 18:45 | mtompset | Nooooo.... you said the Z-word! :P |
| 18:45 | tcohen | only one time |
| 18:45 | wnickc joined #koha | |
| 18:45 | tcohen | the first one i introduced a typo on purpose |
| 18:45 | :-P | |
| 18:46 | mtompset | One more time, and it would appear and kill us all. :P |
| 18:46 | tcohen | we will still have Z fr a while, so we should learn to love it |
| 18:57 | mtompset: do u understand that 'options' might not be necessary anymore as each record carries the relevant information? | |
| 18:57 | mtompset | Haven't had time to read all the code. |
| 18:59 | tcohen: Why "prove t/Koha_Util_MARC.t"? | |
| 18:59 | tcohen | because that class is used ther |
| 18:59 | e | |
| 18:59 | just to make sure is 100% backwards compatible | |
| 18:59 | mtompset | Metadata is not used. |
| 18:59 | I just did a pull before I started this. | |
| 19:00 | tcohen | I think is used in the merge authorities code |
| 19:00 | merging, in general | |
| 19:00 | git grep MetadataRecord | |
| 19:01 | if it is not needed, it doesn't hurt either I guess | |
| 19:05 | ConanTheLibrari joined #koha | |
| 19:07 | ConanTheLibrari | I'm a newbie with Koha and I'm wondering how to print / setup barcode labels? |
| 19:07 | mtompset | Signed off. :) |
| 19:07 | ConanTheLibrari | am I missing something in the wiki? |
| 19:08 | ikourmou joined #koha | |
| 19:10 | ikourmou | test |
| 19:10 | pianohacker | hi ikourmou |
| 19:10 | ikourmou | hello there |
| 19:10 | pianohacker | ConanTheLibrari: Hi! Have you checked the manual, as a first step? (not super familiar with labels) |
| 19:11 | drojf | hi ikourmou |
| 19:12 | ConanTheLibrari | pianohacker - checking now, thanks! |
| 19:12 | ikourmou_ joined #koha | |
| 19:12 | pianohacker | ConanTheLibrari: while we're happy to help, the manual is often the best step if you're looking for instructions rather than troubleshooting :) |
| 19:13 | *best first step | |
| 19:17 | indradg joined #koha | |
| 19:17 | drojf | ikourmou_ i can see you twice ;) |
| 19:18 | tcohen | mtompset: thanks |
| 19:18 | drojf | thanks for joining us btw |
| 19:18 | nengard left #koha | |
| 19:19 | tcohen | ikourmou_: welcome! |
| 19:19 | wahanui | Welcome to zombo.com |
| 19:21 | tcohen | bye #koha |
| 19:21 | * tcohen | crawls back home to recover from the flu |
| 19:21 | ikourmou_ | tcochen: thanks! |
| 19:24 | mtompset | Where are course reserves in 3.20? |
| 19:25 | Oh, there's a system preference for that. | |
| 19:29 | drojf | my community contribution for today is this shiny new wiki page ;) http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]neral_IRC_meeting |
| 19:29 | now we only need elect a "next general irc meeting redirect page update manager" | |
| 19:29 | *need to | |
| 19:30 | pianohacker | oh gosh, I missed the morning meeting, didn't I? |
| 19:31 | drojf | you missed that we abandoned split meetings a few months ago? |
| 19:31 | pianohacker | *blink* for general, or dev meetings? |
| 19:31 | drojf | stop confusing me |
| 19:32 | :D | |
| 19:32 | for general, but it was not too long ago i think | |
| 19:32 | pianohacker | hey, this is an international open source project, we're _all_ supposed to be confused |
| 19:32 | gotcha, though, thanks :) | |
| 19:32 | drojf | its almost dark here and i am sitting on my balcony with a bottle of cidre, don't listen to me |
| 19:32 | pianohacker | *sigh* jealous, it's been a crazy day and I'd happily join you |
| 19:36 | drojf | if you can come to an arrangement with the ever-growing raspberry there is room for one more ;) |
| 19:36 | pianohacker | m'excellent |
| 19:50 | cait joined #koha | |
| 19:50 | cait | irc meeting in 10? |
| 19:52 | drojf | yep |
| 19:52 | cait | could be a short one if it's only us :) |
| 19:52 | drojf | now ikourmou_ left us :/ |
| 19:52 | cait | cool idea with the redirect |
| 19:53 | ikourmou joined #koha | |
| 19:53 | cait | hi ikourmou :) |
| 19:54 | ikourmou | hi there. i seem to have some problems with my connection |
| 19:54 | drojf | ikourmou: the webchat thing is a bit unstable i think |
| 19:55 | pianohacker | hallo |
| 19:55 | ikourmou | I'm on vacation (southern Crete) and my connection is through a wifi hotspot... |
| 19:56 | drojf | oh, ok |
| 19:56 | thanks for joining in from your vacation :) | |
| 19:57 | cait | ok, 3 minutes :) |
| 19:58 | ikourmou | first time on an irc meeting, Mirko invited me so that i could talk about our kohacon proposal |
| 19:58 | cait | very exciting :) |
| 19:58 | i was hoping you might be from greece - from the nicknam | |
| 19:58 | e | |
| 19:58 | drojf | ikourmou: i am mirko by the way :) |
| 19:59 | ikourmou | :-) |
| 19:59 | ok! | |
| 19:59 | cait | have you been to the hackfest in marseille by chance? |
| 19:59 | ikourmou | yes |
| 20:00 | cait | i think we have met then :) |
| 20:00 | pianohacker | ikourmou: were you there in 2014? |
| 20:01 | ikourmou | not this year's though. it was the 2014 |
| 20:01 | cait | cait = Katrin |
| 20:01 | rangi is on the bus, he says 10 min | |
| 20:01 | * cait | tries to wake up people |
| 20:01 | pianohacker | ikourmou: sweet! I'm Jesse, I was the young American |
| 20:01 | ikourmou | hi Katrin, of course i remember you |
| 20:02 | cait | yay :) |
| 20:02 | me too | |
| 20:02 | ok, let's get this started, one sec | |
| 20:02 | ikourmou | hi Jesse. yes, i remembered your nick |
| 20:03 | JesseM | Hi ;P |
| 20:03 | cait | #startmeeting General IRC meeting 5 August 2015 |
| 20:03 | huginn | Meeting started Wed Aug 5 20:03:16 2015 UTC. The chair is cait. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. |
| 20:03 | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | |
| 20:03 | Topic for #koha is now (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 20:03 | huginn | The meeting name has been set to 'general_irc_meeting_5_august_2015' |
| 20:03 | cait | #topic introductions |
| 20:03 | wahanui | #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient |
| 20:03 | Topic for #koha is now introductions (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 20:03 | cait | please follow wahanui's example and introduce yourself with #info |
| 20:03 | pianohacker | #info Jesse Weaver, ByWater Solutions |
| 20:03 | drojf | #info Mirko Tietgen, Berlin, Germany |
| 20:03 | JesseM | #info Jesse Maseto , ByWater Solutions , USA |
| 20:03 | cait | #info Katrin Fischer, BSZ, Germany |
| 20:04 | ikourmou | #info Giannis Kourmoulis, A.U.Th. Greece |
| 20:04 | cait | I think we forgot again to send a reminder about th emeeting... :) |
| 20:04 | drojf | small meeting this time |
| 20:04 | cait | #link http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]ing_5_August_2015 |
| 20:04 | thd | #info Thomas Dukleth, Agogme, New York - Busy helping a friend avoid eviction for having too wonderful a private library |
| 20:05 | cait | i will give a little bit more time for people to show up |
| 20:05 | wnickc joined #koha | |
| 20:05 | barton | #info Barton Chittenden, BWS, Louisville, KY, USA |
| 20:05 | cait | wnickc: #info? :) |
| 20:05 | oh | |
| 20:05 | drojf | nope |
| 20:05 | bag | #info brendan gallagher bywater |
| 20:06 | I’m getting pulled in other directions so I maybe in and out (sorry) | |
| 20:06 | talljoy | #info joy nelson bywater |
| 20:06 | cait | bag: try not to fall apart :) |
| 20:06 | bag | HA |
| 20:06 | barton | can somebody post the link to the meeting itinerary? please? :-) |
| 20:06 | cait | http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]ing_5_August_2015 |
| 20:06 | barton | cait++ |
| 20:07 | cait | slowly moving on then :) |
| 20:07 | #topic Announcements | |
| 20:07 | Topic for #koha is now Announcements (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 20:07 | cait | someone from KohaNa maybe? |
| 20:08 | pianohacker | I think most everyone at Koha NA is out of channel |
| 20:08 | cait | ah wrong time i guess |
| 20:08 | i will have to read the blog posts later then | |
| 20:08 | some other announcement? | |
| 20:08 | pianohacker | cait: one sec |
| 20:09 | cait | *waits* |
| 20:10 | pianohacker | http://bywatersolutions.com/tag/nakug15/ |
| 20:10 | sorry, took a bit to find | |
| 20:10 | can I #link it? | |
| 20:10 | cait | i will do it |
| 20:10 | #link http://bywatersolutions.com/tag/nakug15/ | |
| 20:10 | ok, moving on :) | |
| 20:10 | cdickinson joined #koha | |
| 20:10 | thd | I missed the opening of some |
| 20:10 | wait | |
| 20:11 | cait | hm? |
| 20:11 | thd | I missed the opening of some recent meetings to announce the following. |
| 20:11 | I have been helping a friend avoid eviction for the past two months and for the next month. | |
| 20:12 | pianohacker | cool :) |
| 20:12 | thd | When the ordeal is over I will resume my interrupted work on migrating databases etc. for the wiki. |
| 20:12 | cait | thx thd |
| 20:12 | moving on :) | |
| 20:13 | #topic Update on releases 3.18 - 3.20 | |
| 20:13 | Topic for #koha is now Update on releases 3.18 - 3.20 (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 20:13 | thd | My friend is accused of having too nice a private library for his apartment. |
| 20:13 | cait | btw, please all refresh the agenda |
| 20:13 | mtompset | #info Mark Tompsett |
| 20:13 | cait | some additions have been made |
| 20:13 | rangi | #info chris cormack, catalyst, NZ |
| 20:13 | cait | morning rangi |
| 20:14 | could you give an update on 3.20? | |
| 20:14 | drojf | it is not allowed to make the list longer while the meeting is already running :P |
| 20:14 | rangi | 3.20.3 is on track, nothing special to report |
| 20:14 | cait | i think similar for 3.22 and 3.18 :) |
| 20:15 | there is some interesting stuff in the qa queue | |
| 20:15 | but not a lot that is easy to test :) | |
| 20:15 | as always... please test and sign-off on patches! | |
| 20:16 | ok, moving on ... | |
| 20:16 | mtompset | That's why I was delayed paying attention. ;) |
| 20:16 | cait | #topic KohaCon15 |
| 20:16 | Topic for #koha is now KohaCon15 (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 20:16 | cait | someone around? |
| 20:16 | rangi | doesnt look like it |
| 20:17 | cait | ok |
| 20:17 | moving on i think | |
| 20:17 | rangi | i am going |
| 20:17 | thats all the kohacon15 news i have | |
| 20:17 | drojf | :) |
| 20:17 | cait | rangi++ |
| 20:17 | bag | excellent news |
| 20:18 | cait | ok,... now |
| 20:18 | #topic KohaCon16 | |
| 20:18 | Topic for #koha is now KohaCon16 (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 20:18 | cait | ikourmou: would you like to say something about your plans/proposal? |
| 20:18 | ikourmou | ok. |
| 20:19 | our proposal appears in the respective page | |
| 20:19 | cait | #link http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]haCon16_Proposals |
| 20:19 | thd | Which respective page? |
| 20:19 | ikourmou | we will soon have a dedicated page containing info about the city (Thessaloniki), the university etc |
| 20:20 | we can host the next kohacon on may or june | |
| 20:20 | thd | What about a more detailed proposal which has traditionally been expected of candidate venues? |
| 20:21 | bag | hmm don’t know what you’re talking about thd |
| 20:21 | mtompset | What sort of details are required? I'll nudge the Philippine proposal folks. :) |
| 20:21 | ikourmou | what info should it contain? |
| 20:21 | rangi | proposed dates, proposed venue, .. it doesnt need much more info than that |
| 20:21 | cait | thd: did you see the link to the wiki page? |
| 20:21 | * thd | looks for an example from previous years. |
| 20:21 | cait | both bids are pretty detailed already |
| 20:22 | drojf | and ikourmou just said they will put up some more info |
| 20:22 | bag | thd you thinking of code4lib or something? |
| 20:22 | thd | Maybe I should state the issue differently. |
| 20:22 | mtompset | A proposed weekly schedule? |
| 20:22 | cait | ? |
| 20:23 | rangi | naw, you dont do anything like that until after |
| 20:23 | drojf | mtompset: with blanks all along? because there is no call for papers before the vote |
| 20:23 | cait | i think one nice addition would maybe be a contact email address - but that's about the only thing i am missing |
| 20:23 | rangi | basically, unless you are planning to change the format of 3, 1, 3 to something else, venue, and dates are the main thing |
| 20:23 | thd | We previously disqualified a prospective host and held no vote when one prospective host entered brief details in the wiki but did not link to anything more detailed and then stopped communicating. |
| 20:24 | drojf | thd: have you looked at the wiki page? |
| 20:24 | there are a lot of links already | |
| 20:24 | rangi | naw, that was when someone else entered that persons details in |
| 20:24 | cait | i think the stopped communicating might have been the bit - we also had the case wher esomoene else had entered information from an email to the mailing list as bid |
| 20:24 | rangi | exactly |
| 20:24 | cait | i believe both bids in this case are valid |
| 20:25 | mtompset | 3 out of the 4 people listed in the Philippine proposal are friends of mine on Facebook. ;) |
| 20:25 | thd | Ok, I recognise that the stopped communicating and entry from a third party were the most problematic elements. |
| 20:25 | mtompset | I talk with one of them regularly too. :) |
| 20:25 | thd | Nevermind :) |
| 20:25 | mtompset | The Philippine big is definitely valid. |
| 20:25 | ^big^bid^ | |
| 20:25 | ikourmou | I will add this info (contact email, proposed schedule format) and some background info |
| 20:25 | cait | great |
| 20:25 | rangi | ikourmou: that is perfect |
| 20:26 | ikourmou | we are in the proccess of migration to koha |
| 20:26 | drojf | mtompset: because you are friends with them on facebook? :) |
| 20:26 | bag | excellent ikourmou (best of skills to you) |
| 20:26 | cait | ikourmou: cool - when will you go live? |
| 20:26 | ikourmou | and another university in Thessaloniki just began |
| 20:26 | mtompset | drojf: One is my colleague. :P |
| 20:26 | drojf | nice |
| 20:27 | cait | exciting |
| 20:27 | thd | Just to remind people, in the past the first column usually had a link in the past to a more detailed proposal than could be accommodated in a simple wiki table. |
| 20:27 | ikourmou | my university library is pallning to go live on the 2nd week of september |
| 20:27 | cait | oh soon, good luck! |
| 20:27 | drojf | awesome, good luck |
| 20:28 | cait | ok, the next thing on the agenda was setting a date to start the vote? |
| 20:29 | drojf | someone from the philippines around to tell something? |
| 20:29 | cait | oh yes, sorry |
| 20:29 | drojf | apart from facebook friends? :P |
| 20:29 | mtompset | Sadly, no... it's 4:30am there. |
| 20:29 | drojf | there was an issue with the location i think |
| 20:29 | would be good to know how that works out before we vote | |
| 20:29 | mtompset | When will the vote be? |
| 20:30 | drojf | we will decide that in a minute i guess |
| 20:30 | or we already did, but i did not find a date. just "september" | |
| 20:30 | rangi | it'll be the date of the meeting in september |
| 20:31 | drojf | so we should decide now a) when no new bids are accepted b) when we vote |
| 20:31 | rangi | when we decide that at the end of this meeting :) |
| 20:31 | drojf | we vote at the meeting? |
| 20:31 | cait | we did online votes in the past |
| 20:31 | rangi | i think thats a good time to start it |
| 20:31 | thd | rangi: Would we not have a community wide vote? |
| 20:31 | rangi | online voting for a week after that |
| 20:32 | drojf | works for me |
| 20:32 | cait | ah ok |
| 20:32 | so can we agree on that? | |
| 20:32 | drojf | until when do we accept new bids? right before that? |
| 20:32 | cait | start the online vote at the september meeting? |
| 20:32 | bag | yes +1 (agreed) |
| 20:32 | cait | +1 form me too |
| 20:32 | rangi | +1 |
| 20:32 | mtompset | +1 |
| 20:32 | drojf | +1 |
| 20:33 | cait | #agreed The voting on the bids will beginn with the date of the september general meeting |
| 20:33 | how long? 1 week or 2? | |
| 20:33 | thd | Is automated vote recording not functioning? |
| 20:34 | drojf | and deadline for bidding? |
| 20:34 | cait | thd: i just thought i'd keep it a bit ismpler this time |
| 20:34 | rangi | cait: 1 week seems long enough for me |
| 20:34 | bag | 1 week |
| 20:34 | cait | ok |
| 20:34 | mtompset | 1 week. |
| 20:34 | cait | #vote Shall the vote be open for one week? yes,no |
| 20:34 | bag | I’d say the deadline is now - but of course anyone can object |
| 20:34 | mtompset | yes |
| 20:35 | cait | #startvote Shall the vote be open for one week? yes,no |
| 20:35 | bag | yes |
| 20:35 | huginn | Begin voting on: Shall the vote be open for one week? Valid vote options are yes, no. |
| 20:35 | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | |
| 20:35 | cait | yes |
| 20:35 | mtompset | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | drojf | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | rangi | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | thd | drojf: Did we not just now agree to close bidding from the next meeting? |
| 20:35 | cait | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | thd | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | bag | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | ikourmou | #vote yes |
| 20:35 | drojf | thd: i think we agreed that we start voting then, not the other thing |
| 20:35 | or maybe i got confused :) | |
| 20:35 | rangi | nope we didnt thd, we agreed we will start voting then |
| 20:35 | cait | #agreed The vote will be open for 1 week before closed |
| 20:35 | rangi | bids will need to close before that |
| 20:36 | cait | ok, now we can agree on when to close the time for bidding |
| 20:36 | how about 1 week before the meeting? | |
| 20:36 | drojf | bag: i think doing that without announcement is not the best option |
| 20:36 | rangi | so that the voting site can be set up |
| 20:36 | cait | or 2 weeks? |
| 20:36 | wahanui | 2 weeks is not good nor bad, but thinking makes it so. |
| 20:36 | drojf | a week from now? |
| 20:36 | cait | good for me |
| 20:36 | drojf | no need to wait really |
| 20:36 | rangi | ok by me |
| 20:36 | bag | I feel like we’ve asked for canidates for a few months now |
| 20:36 | mtompset | when is the september meeting? |
| 20:36 | rangi | yeah, exactly |
| 20:36 | its been open for 6 months | |
| 20:36 | drojf | yup |
| 20:36 | cait | #endvote |
| 20:36 | huginn | Voted on "Shall the vote be open for one week?" Results are |
| 20:36 | yes (7): cait, mtompset, bag, thd, drojf, rangi, ikourmou | |
| 20:37 | cait | sorry, forgot to end |
| 20:37 | rangi | if you leave it to the last week .. well, you probably arent the best organiser ;) |
| 20:37 | cait | #info yes (7): cait, mtompset, bag, thd, drojf, rangi, ikourmou |
| 20:37 | drojf | or you are just that awesome ;) |
| 20:37 | rangi | hehe |
| 20:37 | thd | We have had more reminders encouraging candidates in the past but no problems of lack of candidates on this occasion. |
| 20:38 | drojf | i sent a reminder not too long ago, and i think at least one before that |
| 20:38 | rangi | yup |
| 20:38 | schnydszch joined #koha | |
| 20:38 | rangi | there have been 3 in total |
| 20:38 | drojf | if you want to host it, you don't need a lot of reminders ;) |
| 20:38 | rangi | who is willing to send out an email after this meeting |
| 20:38 | thd | drojf++ |
| 20:38 | rangi | with all the dates in it? |
| 20:38 | drojf | i can do that |
| 20:38 | cait | #startvote Shall we close the bidding in one week from now? |
| 20:38 | huginn | Begin voting on: Shall we close the bidding in one week from now? Valid vote options are Yes, No. |
| 20:38 | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | |
| 20:38 | rangi | drojf++ |
| 20:38 | drojf | but probably tomorrow morning |
| 20:38 | rangi | thanks |
| 20:38 | thats fine | |
| 20:39 | #vote yes | |
| 20:39 | drojf | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | cait | #action drojf to send out an email abou the end of the bidding process after the meeting |
| 20:39 | ikourmou | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | thd | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | cait | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | schnydszch | #infoEugene Espinoza philippines |
| 20:39 | mtompset | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | pianohacker | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | bag | #vote yes |
| 20:39 | cait | ready? |
| 20:39 | mtompset | Ah, we have a Philippine proposal person: schnydszch (Eugene Espinoza) |
| 20:40 | cait | #endvote |
| 20:40 | huginn | Voted on "Shall we close the bidding in one week from now?" Results are |
| 20:40 | cait | hm it hangs |
| 20:40 | schnydszch | yes I can't connect to IRC since lastg week |
| 20:40 | cait | #agreed The time to add bids for KohaCon will end in a week from now, drojf is going to send an email |
| 20:40 | drojf | i see 8 yes |
| 20:40 | schnydszch | I tried this lunch Rome time |
| 20:40 | and was able to connect | |
| 20:40 | cait | #info 8 yes, 0 no |
| 20:41 | schnydszch: do you want to say something about your kohacon proposal? | |
| 20:42 | schnydszch | Yes the initial plan of holding it in the National Library of the Philippines seems not possible |
| 20:42 | So we will find a venue elsewhere | |
| 20:42 | And it seems we can't contact NLP, so other koha people in the Philippines have to step up regarding our bid | |
| 20:43 | mtompset | I'll bug Manny about it. |
| 20:43 | schnydszch | we really wanted to involve the National Library in this since they're the biggest koha user in the Phils. |
| 20:43 | I'm also bugging other people on this, since I'm elsewhere | |
| 20:44 | thd | Please update the wiki when you have a new venue etc. |
| 20:44 | cait | hm what should i add to the minutes? |
| 20:45 | schnydszch | Yes and also bugging some people for the official site |
| 20:45 | i mean a website | |
| 20:46 | thd | I suggest adding that the proposal from the Philippines is changing venues in the midst of changing venue and other details. |
| 20:46 | schnydszch | so voting will be this september right? |
| 20:46 | drojf | yes |
| 20:46 | cait | #info venue will probably move from the national library to elsewhere - wiki page to be updated |
| 20:46 | thd | Yes, starting from the next general IRC meeting date. |
| 20:46 | cait | schnydszch: yes, we will set the exact date at the end of this meeting |
| 20:47 | thd | cait: add Philippines to your note |
| 20:48 | ikourmou | could someone please give a short explanation on the voting procedure? |
| 20:48 | cait | schnydszch: maybe you can update the wiki page that it will not be national library? |
| 20:48 | just to avoid confusion | |
| 20:49 | ikourmou: good question | |
| 20:49 | schnydszch: because it states as hosting organisation, so it looks like they organize it | |
| 20:49 | i didn't understand the difference until now i think | |
| 20:50 | or maybe still misunderstanding | |
| 20:51 | drojf | ikourmou: someone will set up a website to vote. i did a limesurvey once for a vote, i think we had other systems too. it will be open for a week, everyone can vote |
| 20:52 | cait | what information did we require last time? |
| 20:52 | thd | cait: You identified a reason for a more detailed proposal linked from the simple wiki table. However, a column for venue could be added. |
| 20:52 | drojf | i dont know. i asked for an email address when i did it |
| 20:53 | and a name | |
| 20:53 | cait | sounds good to me |
| 20:53 | rangi | yeah thats about all |
| 20:53 | ikourmou | drojf: ok, and by "everyone" you mean? |
| 20:53 | rangi | everyone |
| 20:53 | wahanui | somebody said everyone was doin' the hot new dance the Cracked Out Kitty Tail Shiver |
| 20:53 | thd | Actually, venue is probably best understood as part of the location column. |
| 20:53 | cait | ikourmou: every individual person has a vote |
| 20:53 | drojf | ikourmou: we will announce it to the koha mailing lists, but it is not restricted to that |
| 20:54 | ikourmou | got it. |
| 20:55 | cait | ok, can we agree on the voting procedure? email and name? |
| 20:55 | rangi | most people are pretty good about it, we've only had one occasion in 8 years where people with no interest in koha were mobilised to vote |
| 20:55 | cait | and is someone volunteering to set up the tool for voting? |
| 20:55 | rangi | it's pretty easy to spot when that happens |
| 20:56 | drojf | i can set something up if nobody wants to |
| 20:56 | rangi | if you have time, that would be great drojf |
| 20:56 | drojf | and would probably nominate one or two people to have a look |
| 20:56 | rangi | sounds good |
| 20:56 | drojf | well, if that limesurvey still exists. lol not used that in ages |
| 20:57 | schnydszch joined #koha | |
| 20:57 | cait | #startvote Shall we let drojf set up the vote= |
| 20:57 | huginn | Unable to parse vote topic and options. |
| 20:57 | bag | drojf: you can ask nengard - she’s done it before |
| 20:57 | for help that is :) | |
| 20:57 | cait | #startvote Shall we let drojf set up the vote? |
| 20:57 | huginn | Begin voting on: Shall we let drojf set up the vote? Valid vote options are Yes, No. |
| 20:57 | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | |
| 20:57 | cait | #yes |
| 20:57 | rangi | #vote yes |
| 20:57 | bag | #vote yes |
| 20:57 | cait | i'd add a ! but the vote thing won't like it |
| 20:57 | thd | #vote yes |
| 20:57 | drojf | #vote abstain ;) |
| 20:57 | ikourmou | #vote yes |
| 20:57 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 20:58 | mtompset | #vote yes |
| 20:58 | cait | #vote yes |
| 20:58 | #endvote | |
| 20:58 | huginn | Voted on "Shall we let drojf set up the vote?" Results are |
| 20:58 | drojf | no cookie for huginn |
| 20:58 | cait | #agreed We are going to let drojf set up the vote :) |
| 20:59 | thd | drojf: You should always vote for yourself if you are not excluded by some rule. |
| 20:59 | drojf | thd: i'm too shy ;) |
| 20:59 | thd | :) |
| 20:59 | cait | #startvote Shall the details being asked for be name and email address? |
| 20:59 | huginn | Begin voting on: Shall the details being asked for be name and email address? Valid vote options are Yes, No. |
| 20:59 | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | |
| 20:59 | cait | i am getting the hang of that vote thing *tortures you all* |
| 20:59 | #yes | |
| 20:59 | rangi | no you arent |
| 21:00 | drojf | lol |
| 21:00 | rangi | you just voted wrong again :) |
| 21:00 | cait | #vote yes |
| 21:00 | pf. | |
| 21:00 | rangi | #vote yes |
| 21:00 | drojf | #vote yes |
| 21:00 | thd | The understanding is still that the votes submitted are secret except to those conducting the poll. |
| 21:00 | mtompset | #vote yes |
| 21:00 | thd | #vote yes |
| 21:00 | cait | thd: yes i think so |
| 21:00 | drojf | thd: yes |
| 21:01 | cait | #info votes are submitted secret except to those conducting the poll |
| 21:01 | #endvote | |
| 21:01 | huginn | Voted on "Shall the details being asked for be name and email address?" Results are |
| 21:01 | cait | #agreed the vote will ask for name and email |
| 21:01 | ok, i think we got it all? | |
| 21:01 | moving on? | |
| 21:02 | bag | yup move on |
| 21:03 | cait | #topic Fundraising |
| 21:03 | Topic for #koha is now Fundraising (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 21:03 | * cait | hands the hat to bag |
| 21:03 | bag | ok |
| 21:03 | Next steps in Fundraising | |
| 21:03 | first a vote | |
| 21:04 | topic is Voting on additional candidates (see Fundraising) for the Fund Raising Committee. | |
| 21:04 | So we voted in the general meeting and then afterwards paul_p added his name to the committee | |
| 21:04 | we want to vote on if that is ok with everyone for him to join the committee | |
| 21:04 | cait can you handle the vote process? | |
| 21:04 | I’ll answer questions | |
| 21:05 | mtompset | Can we recap who is on the committee? |
| 21:05 | cait | #link http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Fundraising |
| 21:05 | bag | gmcharlt, BobB, bag, Romana |
| 21:05 | and then vote on Paul_P acceptance | |
| 21:06 | cait | #startvote Are we ok with Paul Poulain joining the fundraising committee? |
| 21:06 | huginn | Begin voting on: Are we ok with Paul Poulain joining the fundraising committee? Valid vote options are Yes, No. |
| 21:06 | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | |
| 21:06 | mtompset | Okay, so we are just voting on Paul, because he was added after vote? |
| 21:06 | cait | yes |
| 21:06 | to get things tidied up | |
| 21:06 | mtompset | #vote yes |
| 21:06 | bag | (not voting since I am on committee) |
| 21:06 | cait | we already elected the other people |
| 21:06 | schnydszch | #vote yes |
| 21:06 | thd | #vote yes |
| 21:06 | ikourmou | #vote yes |
| 21:06 | schnydszch | for Paul Poulain |
| 21:07 | cait | #endvote |
| 21:07 | huginn | Voted on "Are we ok with Paul Poulain joining the fundraising committee?" Results are |
| 21:07 | cait | #agreed Paul Poulain was elected to join the Fundraising committee |
| 21:08 | bag | Cool - ok I’m taking over again cait |
| 21:08 | cait++ | |
| 21:08 | thanks | |
| 21:08 | cait | thx |
| 21:08 | bag | here’s an update (few lines pasted in) |
| 21:08 | Another committee meeting coming soon (talk about raising money, grants, and next steps) | |
| 21:08 | Donate button added to main page of koha-community.org (In my opinion (will bring to the committee and the mailing list) too low on page - should be up top and not causing people to have to "search" for it) | |
| 21:08 | More volunteers needed on committee | |
| 21:08 | Establish rules for grants/invoicing committee | |
| 21:09 | cait | #link http://koha-community.org/ |
| 21:09 | drojf | i don't see anything |
| 21:09 | mtompset | bottom right. |
| 21:09 | wahanui | bottom right is bridgton in maine |
| 21:09 | cait | scroll down |
| 21:09 | mtompset | you may need to scroll. |
| 21:09 | bag | thanks for backup my point drojf :D |
| 21:09 | heh | |
| 21:10 | s/backup/backing up | |
| 21:10 | drojf | no i do not allow third party stuff like loading things from paypal |
| 21:10 | :P | |
| 21:10 | thd | bag: There is still a basic problem that most everyone currently on the committee should by the conflict of interest rules recuse themselves in many circumstances leaving no quorum. |
| 21:10 | cait | but i don't know hwer to put it nicely |
| 21:10 | i mean ... at the top | |
| 21:10 | bag | ah there you go drojf - that’s why |
| 21:10 | drojf | can we have a non-paypal-servery button? |
| 21:11 | bag | drojf: provide the code and we can |
| 21:11 | drojf | ok i will have a look |
| 21:11 | bag | thd: the committee established so far is only to bring money into the fund - not spend it |
| 21:12 | cait | #info donate button was added to the kc website (scroll down) |
| 21:12 | thd | bag: As long as the issue is recognised and corrected in due course if it could not be corrected in advance to give more confidence. |
| 21:12 | cait | #info committee to meet soon again |
| 21:13 | bag | and thd if the committee once those rules are set - decides to hire a third party - let’s say equinox to do some sign-off/testing - then only those who work for equinox should remove themselves |
| 21:13 | Francesca | good moning |
| 21:13 | *morning | |
| 21:14 | thd | bag: Certainly, however, the appearance would be better if more librarians would be involved. |
| 21:14 | bag | thd agreed - hence we need more volunteers - they just aren’t coming |
| 21:14 | cait | yeah.. but i think that's the point of asking for more members :) |
| 21:14 | bag | do you have a suggestion for recruiting some of the librarians? |
| 21:14 | can you do that ? | |
| 21:14 | please :D | |
| 21:14 | I’ll send cookies and chocoloate | |
| 21:15 | cait | mybe indeed we could ask people to also suggest someone they think would be a good fit...? |
| 21:15 | Francesca | ohh cookies and chocolate |
| 21:15 | drojf | "You can build your own Button Text Links from scratch or take advantage of the Online Button Creator within your PayPal Account. After generating the button code online, select the "Email" tab to view the Text Link Code." |
| 21:15 | looks like someone with access to the account has to do it, but its possible | |
| 21:15 | cait | and then ask them of course |
| 21:15 | bag | I think we need suggestions too cait… |
| 21:15 | K_chris joined #koha | |
| 21:16 | thd | The problem may be in the US a need for a US based funding organisation which is an issue which I had lost time to address for IRS non-profit status. |
| 21:16 | cait | #info We are looking for more volunteers for the fundraising committee |
| 21:16 | bag | cool drojf can you send me information. THT has control of the bank account - so I’ll talk to them |
| 21:16 | drojf | i will send you an email tomorrow |
| 21:17 | bag | #info and any suggestion to the committee on how to make it so more librarians are interested in joining :) |
| 21:17 | drojf | so many things to send tomorrow heh |
| 21:17 | bag | also an update. I think we are finally almost past the legal stuff - where we finally get to have some fun and move forward with fund raising |
| 21:18 | bbias | |
| 21:18 | back | |
| 21:18 | that’s really it from me cait | |
| 21:18 | cait | ok |
| 21:18 | anything that should go in th eminutes? | |
| 21:18 | bag | if there are no more questions - I think we can move on |
| 21:19 | cait | ok |
| 21:19 | #topic Support vendor listing | |
| 21:19 | Topic for #koha is now Support vendor listing (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 21:19 | cait | i tihnkwe had agreed to have more discussion during this meeting |
| 21:19 | wizzyrea | #info Liz Rea, Catalyst IT |
| 21:19 | cait | and a helpful soul set up a wiki page for proposed changes/solutions: |
| 21:19 | #link http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]roviders_list_RFC | |
| 21:19 | but sadly, it#s empty | |
| 21:19 | wizzyrea | heh |
| 21:20 | cait | i'd like to postpone this topic as this meeting is a bit long already |
| 21:20 | drojf | +1 |
| 21:20 | rangi | everyone has opinions, no one wants to do anything |
| 21:20 | postpone for ever as far as im concerned | |
| 21:20 | cait | i think we got some more company pages in the wiki now |
| 21:20 | but nothing has been communicated | |
| 21:21 | #info Discussion about Paid support providers list to be postponed - please add to the RFC if you want things to move | |
| 21:21 | thd | rangi++ |
| 21:21 | cait | #topic GBSD |
| 21:21 | Topic for #koha is now GBSD (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 21:21 | cait | the plan is sitll on - i haven't send an email yt |
| 21:21 | i hope to get to that this week | |
| 21:21 | there isa first draft of a wiki page available | |
| 21:22 | #link http://wiki.koha-community.org[…]bug_squashing_day | |
| 21:22 | i want to ask for ideas, wish list item etc. and aso for people to host tutorials | |
| 21:22 | or help testing features they developed... whatever you can think of | |
| 21:22 | there is a new section on the page "Specials for this GBSD" | |
| 21:22 | please add yourself there if you plan to contribute something to the event! | |
| 21:23 | i will probably weed the links above a bit to make the page a bit more compact | |
| 21:23 | moving on? | |
| 21:24 | #topic Actions from last meeting | |
| 21:24 | Topic for #koha is now Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 21:24 | cait | khall volunteered to run a virtual bootcamp during GBSD (will remind him :) ) |
| 21:24 | and i will send the promised email soon | |
| 21:24 | #link http://meetings.koha-community[…]-07-08-10.00.html | |
| 21:25 | #topic Agree on date for next meeting | |
| 21:25 | Topic for #koha is now Agree on date for next meeting (Meeting topic: General IRC meeting 5 August 2015) | |
| 21:25 | cait | early september? |
| 21:25 | first wednesday? that would be the 2nd | |
| 21:25 | thd | 9 Sep. |
| 21:26 | drojf | i think 9 does not work for m |
| 21:26 | me | |
| 21:26 | (you can still have a meeting then) | |
| 21:27 | schnydszch | sept 9 please |
| 21:27 | cait | hm i thought we had agreed to stick to the first week |
| 21:27 | thd | I think that concluding a vote a week from 9 would be better for having people back from holidays etc. |
| 21:28 | cait | ok |
| 21:28 | drojf: which time? | |
| 21:28 | wahanui | which time is probably better for my area? 10:00+0000 or 22:00+0000? |
| 21:28 | rangi | what holidays |
| 21:28 | thd | Also a specific request from one candidate should be given attention. |
| 21:28 | cait | drojf: you know it's your job to tell me the time of the next meeting :) |
| 21:28 | drojf | aren#t there always holidays somewhere? |
| 21:28 | thd | 10 UTC |
| 21:29 | schnydszch | 22:00+0000 is what time in the phils? |
| 21:29 | 10UTC? | |
| 21:29 | wahanui | it has been said that 10UTC is what we've decided = 18UTC (today) -8 |
| 21:29 | Francesca | @wunder wlg |
| 21:29 | huginn | Francesca: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 8.0°C (9:00 AM NZST on August 06, 2015). Conditions: Light Rain. Humidity: 93%. Dew Point: 7.0°C. Windchill: 5.0°C. Pressure: 29.44 in 997 hPa (Falling). |
| 21:29 | thd | drojf: Yes, however, many academic calendars widely used would encourage a later rather than earlier time in the month |
| 21:30 | drojf | citation needed |
| 21:30 | cait | ok, so 10 UTC on september 9? |
| 21:31 | don't make me start the votebot again | |
| 21:31 | mtompset | http://www.ocdsb.ca/calendar/P[…]---2015-2016.aspx |
| 21:31 | September 8 is firstday of school, so people will be back from holidays, drojf. | |
| 21:31 | thd | drojf: Sorry, I only have anecdotal information about the range of academic calendars in the US running from times starting in late August to mid September. |
| 21:32 | cait | #agreed 9 September, 10 UTC |
| 21:33 | #endmeeting | |
| 21:33 | Topic for #koha is now Welcome to the IRC home of Koha http://koha-community.org | Code of conduct - http://koha-community.org/abou[…]/code-of-conduct/ | Please use http://paste.koha-community.org for pastes | Installation guide for Koha is http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Debian | |
| 21:33 | huginn | Meeting ended Wed Aug 5 21:33:06 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) |
| 21:33 | Minutes: http://meetings.koha-community[…]-08-05-20.03.html | |
| 21:33 | Minutes (text): http://meetings.koha-community[…]5-08-05-20.03.txt | |
| 21:33 | Log: http://meetings.koha-community[…]05-20.03.log.html | |
| 21:33 | bag | thanks cait! |
| 21:33 | drojf | cait++ |
| 21:33 | mtompset | cait++ |
| 21:33 | cait | thx everyone for attending |
| 21:35 | drojf | i hope someone took notes of all the stuff i have to send tomorrow :O |
| 21:35 | :P | |
| 21:37 | cait | i forgot the action about the button |
| 21:37 | wizzyrea | oh yes someone tell me |
| 21:37 | what needs doing there | |
| 21:38 | also I'm sorry I missed the section on that because I have opinions, and I feel like I need something to link to that explains wtf the money goes for. | |
| 21:38 | drojf | wizzyrea: i will send an email to bag telling him what to tell THT to generate a code that they will probably send back to bag and he can send it to you. i think ;) |
| 21:38 | wizzyrea | O.o |
| 21:38 | thd | bag: Please understand that if I had money to give to Koha generally giving it too a group largely consisting of Koha vendors would probably best ensure that it would be spent wisely and frugally. However, such an arrangement is obviously problematic. |
| 21:38 | wizzyrea | that seems convoluted. |
| 21:39 | bag | huh |
| 21:39 | thd | bag: For which was huh? |
| 21:40 | bag | I don’t understand you thd |
| 21:40 | I’ve got to run | |
| 21:40 | wizzyrea: I’ll catch up with you | |
| 21:40 | we can talk and figure out what’s best for language | |
| 21:41 | wizzyrea | ok great because I was winging it and it's not my thing :P |
| 21:41 | bag | perhaps wizzyrea we can have something for people to vote on next meeting |
| 21:41 | but wizzyrea it’s awesome so far - so thanks much | |
| 21:42 | wizzyrea | ...for the record I am not in favour of a vote. |
| 21:42 | for that. | |
| 21:42 | Francesca joined #koha | |
| 21:44 | thd | bag: I merely meant that a vendor dominated committee may spend funding more wisely than a librarian dominated one. However, the appearance will still be a problem. |
| 21:53 | wizzyrea | My concern is what work comes out of it. I worry that it won't be very forward thinking, and will lead to "implement this like horizon did it" - that's the nicest way I can say that I think. |
| 21:54 | * Francesca | waves at wizzyrea |
| 21:54 | wizzyrea | hi Francesca |
| 21:54 | Francesca | how goes it? |
| 21:55 | wizzyrea | ah alright, busy busy |
| 21:59 | Francesca | I can tell |
| 22:02 | JoshB joined #koha | |
| 22:16 | drojf | good night #koha |
| 22:23 | eythian | hi |
| 22:23 | wahanui | hi, eythian |
| 22:23 | Francesca | hi eythian |
| 22:25 | eythian | oh, there was a meeting. I totally didn't know. |
| 22:35 | wizzyrea | lulz, labels is a "tool" but it's permission is for "catalogue" |
| 22:35 | its* | |
| 22:40 | eythian | "tools" is a dumping ground for all manner of crap that could probably be better organised. |
| 22:41 | wizzyrea | yeah, I'm poking around in the labels interface, removing the necessity of a billion clicks. |
| 22:41 | to do stuff. | |
| 22:41 | or that's what I was doing yesterday evening. | |
| 22:41 | with quite good success, I think. | |
| 22:41 | cait | hm but we do have a label permission... |
| 22:42 | i should not ask and just go to bed | |
| 22:42 | :) | |
| 22:42 | night all | |
| 22:42 | wahanui | goodnight cait. You'll be back. |
| 22:42 | wizzyrea | :) |
| 22:42 | don't dig too deep, you might get lost in there. | |
| 22:42 | cait | yeah :) |
| 22:42 | cait left #koha | |
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| 23:10 | JoshB left #koha | |
| 23:42 | tcohen joined #koha | |
| 23:42 | NateC joined #koha | |
| 23:44 | tcohen joined #koha | |
| 23:58 | eythian | http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominio[…]llington-archives |
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